No One Can Question C.J.'s Public Confession of Specific Sin - Really?
Wednesday, August 3, 2011 at 1:24PM Where do I begin?
Four weeks ago, today, I sent out "The Documents" (see sgmwikileaks) to all the pastors in Sovereign Grace Ministries. Since then I've been watching and waiting. It is now time for comment on what I've observed. Hence this blog.
I've also begun Aletheia Ministries - a separate Facebook page and website is in the works. I don't plan to use Aletheia, which is the Greek word for truth, in order to address personal issues or individuals within Sovereign Grace Ministries. I will do that on this blog. More on Aletheia Ministries in the future.
I want my posts to be focused and of limited length. Therefore, I don't plan to make or develop too many points at one time. At least I'll try not to. Instead, I'll attempt to develop the point(s) I make and bring home its implications. I'll build new points upon previous points. I plan to write two or three times a week. Sign up to receive posts automatically under the "Connect" section using "Subscribe in a reader" or "Subscribe to BrentDetwiler by Email." I also want to use language that is accessible (you know, understandable) to the average reader.
Well, that's enough of an introduction. I'll tell you how nice a guy I am later. Let's get going.
Yesterday, Dave Harvey, interim President of Sovereign Grace Ministries, posted the preliminary findings of a three man panel on the SGM blog. The panel was asked "to offer non-binding advice on the narrow question as to whether C.J. Mahaney is presently fit for ministry based on those sins to which he has already confessed."
Today, I am going to deal with one part of one statement in their finding. That is, "No one can question that C.J. Mahaney has specifically confessed his sins, both publicly and privately."
A few brief observations.
- "No one" - this is a categorical statement, a universal negative, not a single person.
- "can question" - the evidence is so overwhelming it cannot be questioned, end of debate, it is a shut and closed case, no further examination is necessary.
- "that C.J. Mahaney has specifically confessed his sins." - this is an assertion with no proof, the panel provides no information regarding the specific sins C.J. has confessed, the reader is left to research the matter for himself, very unhelpful.
- "both publicly and privately" - the panel claims C.J.'s confession of specific sins has unquestionably occurred in private and in public, that's obvious to them.
I want to address the last part of this authoritative assertion regarding C.J.'s public confession.
There have been two occasions when C.J. "confessed" his sin in public. The first time in a Sovereign Grace blog on July 6, 2011 entitled, "Why I am taking a leave of absence." The second in person on July 10, 2011 at Covenant Life Church (CLC). In my next two blog posts, I will provide detailed comments on those "specific" confessions according to DeYoung, Ortlund and Trueman. For now, let me summate my findings in contrast to their findings.
- Nothing in C.J.'s July 6 blog is specific and it hardly qualifies as a confession. It is a vague acknowledgement of unspecified "sins" and "deficiencies." Read it closely.
- Little in C.J.'s July 10 confession is specific and those comments are confined to Dave and me back in 2003-2004. Otherwise, C.J.'s comments to CLC are vague, general, and non-descript. For example, he says, "in a particular phone conversation I sought to coerce Larry...my public announcement of his departure was self-righteous in attitude and critical of Larry." He doesn't go into any detail. He provides little background. He doesn't share particulars (for that kind of information you must read Part 3: Concluding Remarks, pages 131-179 at sgmwikileaks). At the end of his comments, C.J. says to CLC, "I want to ask for your forgiveness for these sins and their effects on you." What does he mean specifically? What sins against CLC is he talking about? What adverse effects upon the church does he have in mind? He makes none of this clear.
I responded to Joshua's humble note and added my thoughts about the deficiencies of C.J.'s remarks.
Of course, C.J. has not returned to CLC since July 10. He has not been to any Sunday morning meetings or any subsequent Sunday evening Member's Meetings.
Okay, let me wrap things up. DeYoung, Ortlund and Trueman concluded their findings with this statement.
"Having said all that, here is our conclusion. We do not believe C.J. Mahaney's confessed sins have disqualified him from Christian ministry. Or to put it positively, from all that we have seen, heard, and read, we believe C.J. Mahaney is, at this moment in time and based on those sins which he has acknowledged, still fit to be a minister of the gospel of Jesus Christ and a pastor to others."
Here's the stunner! I totally agree with their conclusion! Based on C.J.'s publicly "confessed sins" he is not disqualified. Why? Because he acknowledged next to nothing and nothing specific except for his treatment of Dave and me eight to nine years ago! So based upon his public confessions, the three man panel is correct - C.J. is "still fit to be a minister of the gospel of Jesus Christ and a pastor to others." Thanks Kevin, Ray and Carl for making that clear to all of us.
Reader Comments (51)
Rebekah
One of the things I find notable in your posting and I have noticed in many many members of SGM churches including Conenant Life (member for 29 years ther) is the language you use to describe your experiences with your SGM church. Here us the typical language employed. " my church has been an avenue of great grace." others state it this way, "I have been greatly blessed by CJ' teaching" or "I wouldn't be the Christiam I am today without CJ/SGM/Insert your pastors name." is this just sloppy writing or undisciplined thinking. It is not your church, it is nit CJ, it is not your pastor who has caused one iota of blessing/grace/growth in your life -- it is God's mercy, grace, love, and presence that caused all and any blessings in your life.
After I left CLC I had to make a deliberate effort to change my thinking and my speech. Don't get me wrong, God does use men (and women) to guide us along. My current pastor is a good friend of mine and I appreciate his sermons and advice into my life. But it is not him who is blessing me.
Regardless of your intent in your wording, attributing to men or an organization the blessings you receive is idolatry. God is at work in you and not your pastor. I hope you see this.
One last thing. Your closing remark also typifies the mindset of many in SGM influenced churches: the constant reference to sin or indwelling sin. What do think happened on the cross. Did not the sacrificial death of Jesus prove to you that where sin abounds grace abounds all the more. Jesus did not stay on the cross; he was resurrected and ascended to heaven. The cross was the sufficient and necessary beginning but the resurrection and ascension along with the pouring out of the Holy Spirit for us is where we as regenerated children of God is the true place we live as Christians. There is a noticeable tendency across many SGM churches to focus on sin and mention grace as an after thought. Grace is the far more appropriate state Christians are in, not sin.
Dear Brent,
I attend a SGM church now, but have not grown up in SGM; as an outsider to the ministry and to a lot of what is going on/surfacing, it seems to me that you may very well be overstepping your boundaries. The emails, comments, and posts that you have published seem extremely "biting", unloving, and relentless. Everything that I have read seems to paint you as being bitter and quite angry, not someone that is full of compassion and care.
Further, it also seems as if you're devoting quite a bit of your life to this; why not focus this energy on literally reaching the lost and using your potential gifts in the ways that God has seen fit to give you? It may not be your intention; however, I can see how this situation can and may very well already be stirring up much much trouble. Most of the things that you have posted seem to be pointing to the fact that C.J. is not perfect; it also seems as if you might be pushing towards an unnecessary (and unhelpful) amount of introspection. I don't know C.J. personally, however, from everything I know about him as well as knowing others that know Him well, it seems as if he is quite willing to look at his life, address sins that he sees or that others point out with the best of his ability and by the Spirit.
Sir and fellow brother in Christ, I ask you to examine your own intentions, thoughts, feelings, etc... and ask yourself if what you are saying, how you're spending your time, and what your life is about right now is profitable? Are you seeking to build up, encourage, and love? If indeed we're called to do everything to the glory of God (Col 3), then how does your behavior align? I am asking the same questions regarding what you have published.
[Tim. I don't know if you've had time to read all my documents. Hopefully, you can see my intent and motivation in what I've written. Brent]
I’ve let the two comments through from Rob in order to illustrate the purpose of my blog and the limitations I face in answering people’s questions or addressing accusations – not because of his intimidation. Of course, anyone can go elsewhere and anonymously say all kinds of things about me because I didn’t let their comment through. That’s fine. If I were out to win a popularity contest I’d never have voiced concerns for C.J. and SGM.
As editor, I let through the vast majority of comments I receive but I don’t post all of them. Some are hateful. Others belligerent. I didn’t create the blog for people to bash me (which is different from disagreeing with me). That can be done on other blogs. Or if you want, you can email me. The purpose for my blog is different than Refuge or Survivors. I want to interact over the issues addressed in what I’ve written. My focus is more narrow. I am trying to provide thoughtful commentary based upon careful analysis.
Sometimes, people like Rob express criticisms and I simply don’t have the time to answer. I don’t mind Rob’s comments. I just don’t want to post them unless I have time to answer. They are harmful if left unaddressed. I don’t have the resources of SGM or CLC. This is a one man operation.
Now to Rob. I wanted to know C.J.’s current salary so I could make a recommendation to the Board for a reduction. That was my purpose. Not to post it on the internet. C.J. promised to provide me that information. He broke that promise and the Board violated its standing policy that Directors should be open about their compensation if asked. That is serious. I also agree with others who have said this information should be a matter of public record anyway. You shouldn’t have to ask. The Board’s response demonstrated unwillingness to be transparent. That should alarm everyone and everyone has a right to know about this refusal since it is another illustration of not be transparent. I am not spinning anything. These are the simple facts.
I got a kick out of your last question Rob. “Wouldn't you be hesitant to say anything about your life at all if you knew someone will post it online and then others will twist it to be absolutely terrible.” First, I’ve worked very hard not to twist anything. I’ve sought to document all my concerns. They can be dismissed as slander but they are rooted in fact with little to no interpretation necessary. Second, if I were preoccupied with how people twisted things and used them against me, I’d be in another line of work.
To Steve....better check with your attorney on e-mail confidentiality issues or you could find yourself in court. Even your own quoted source says "...but if you want to stay strictly in the law, you should ask first". Gaining permission is only a safeguard against damages, not someone interested in pursuing frivolous lawsuits. We live in a litigious minded (and fallen) world Steve.....I win LOL ;)
Brent, keep up the "good work"....God bless your efforts
Justan please refute what I have said with something other than your opinion. Find a law on the books that states the recipient of email is violating some law. One other point. The reference I gave is for tort law not criminal. Do you know the difference? Any one can file a tort law suit against anyone for any reason. It is then up to a judge to dertmine if the case has merit. Again, please supply a case where between private parties like Brent and SGM a ruling was made by a judge or jury in favor of the confidentiality of those emails. If you can do this and I confirm the situations are analogous then I will be more than happy to admit I was wrong. In the meantime perhaps you can stop making claims about stuff without any kind of documentary support.
Thanks
Brent,
Is there any way to get the actual financial records (Maybe the IRS?) of SGM or any of the churches?
I have had it with you already! Please mind your own business and leave the Mahaneys alone. You have caused enough damage...are you happy? C.J. loves the Lord and is a man of integrity.
[MM - C.J. does love the Lord but he has consistently demonstrated a lack of integrity. These are not wild accusations. I'd encourage you to read "The Documents." I am not "happy" for the discipline C.J. (and SGM) is experiencing but it is necessary and good. Brent]
How shameful that this, and much more, is being aired for all of the non-Christian world to see! Shame on you, Mr. Detwilerr, for dealing with these issues in a way that dishonors the name of Christ.
[Kendall - for 11 years I tried to help C.J. in private. So did others. We were largely unsucessful. There comes a time when you must "tell it to the church." Brent]
Kendall those of us who have experienced just a small portion of what Brent Detwiler has gone through do not see his actions as dishonoring to the Lord. And as a small reminder, the Bible is full of the dirty laundry of the people of God for all the world to see -- murder, adultery, decetfullness, pride, anger, stupidity, and virtually every other human foible and weakness. Our humaness and the accompanying imperfections are generally good things to be exposed by the light of the Holy Spirit. It keeps us humble and reminds us us of our eternal need for God's unwavering grace. What better testimony to the world is the public story of men and women saved, redeemed, and sanctified by God's rich mercy. That is Brent's purpose with the release if these documents and his personal blog. He is not the one who released the documents that led to this blog, that was someone else's doing.
One last thing. It is always better to offer some support for any claims of dishonoring the Lord's name. In my denomination part if our statement of faith reads that "whatever is not contained therein (the scriptures) is not be enjoined as an article of faith." In other words, if it is not specifically forbidden in the Bible, it is not to made into a rule of faith. You claim that Brent' actions are dishonoring the Lord (a very serious sin) please provide us with something biblical (and not just your opinion) that we can look to as guidance here.
Methinks I see a new tack taking shape. It seems the " the dogs of war" have been unleashed, if I may borrow a literary allusion. Here is what I mean.. Today there has been an unusual jump in the number of posts from folks critical of this blog and Brent's expose of the admitted failings of SGM and CJ (admitted, that is, by many prominent SGM church leaders). To date there have not been very many " negative" posts on this specific blog. Why the very sudden uptick in these types of posts? BTW, since this is a moderated blog, meaning the posts are reviewed by the blog owner(Brent?), prior to being posted, it speaks loudly of Brent's willingness to take some criticism. Hopefully, those posting these types of posts will take note of that and realize that this is a sure sign if humility (or if you prefer to be judgmental , a very clever ploy to appear that way).
Is there perhaps a planned and implemented strategy revealed in the sudden number if these posts? Is this a loyalist's plot?
BTW, this post us intended to be somewhat tongue-in-cheek. I woke up this morning and virtually ever post I read was negative -- except mine if course. I thought this was a notable trend. Notice, I said "somewhat": meaning I think, that if the trend continues today and over the next few days, the possibility that a "media campaign" has been implemented by SGM should be considered.
That may strike some as cynical, however, as I told my wife last night, trust is a demanding taskmaster and once lost, demands a healthy and biblical dose of skepticism and questioning of motives. Here is an example. Everyone I know who has been affected by the results of the release of Brent's documents and this blog recognize that the leadership of CLC realizes that trust in them was severly undermined (they acknowledged this at the July 10th member's meeting -- I was there). Everyone I know in the previously mentioned group recognizes that the CLC leadership is doing virtually everything possible to rebuild that trust. In this sense they are the exact opposite of both SGM and CJ, who seem to doing everything possible to engender distrust. It is enlightening and helpful to have have the actions of these two groups of men contrasted side-by-side. You decide.
Brethren,there are worse sins being committed in large ministries like SGM, sins involving scandals - sex , millions of money ,misuse of power. So glad that CJ was not involved in any of these , He is a great man of GOD .You write page upon page about CJ's sins and I can't get it . What exactly has he done to you that you cannot forgive? Did not the bible ask us to forgive others so we can be forgiven.?YOu need to deal with your heart and bitterness towards him and pain that you were dismissed and MOVE ON..... we have all gone through heart aches , personal and career and hurt but when we walk with GOd , he causes all things to work for our good.
this is way over board and you need counsel. How does your wife, kids feel about this, you are probably hurting them more than the person you are attacking. All of us have issues with pride , sin ,anger daily and leaders are more prone to that but there is grace for us. Please get counsel and stop this. THe world is under siege from anti christ movements and we as christians need to love each other and stay united to win souls. I am begging you , let it go, go for a long retreat , awy from your computer and determine to forgive those that you say have offended you. From what I read , CJ and SGM want to reconcile with you and learn from what ever mistakes they may have made . This will bring their ministry more praise admiration , there are no skeletons in their closet after over 30 yrs in ministry. As we speak , in some countries, christians are being killed by anti- christ movements, yet you sit comfortably in your home, drooling over this issue like it is life threatening to you or any other person.What have you learnt from this ? has it make you a better chririan or a bitter one?